Thief of Bagdad on bluray

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bigshot

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Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Dec 28, 2012 1:14 am

I heard this is being released in February with a Carl Davis score. It's the Photoplay version. Can someone explain the differences between versions to me please?

Thanks!
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buskeat

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Re: Theif of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Dec 28, 2012 1:09 pm

What differences are you looking for? As far as footage, I don't know, but my understanding is that the Thief of Baghdad blu-ray is being released by Cohen Film Collection, which now owns the Rohauer Collection, the source (I believe) of the Brownlow/Gill/Photoplay version, which was released on HBO Video on VHS in the late '80s. What I don't know is whether there's any difference in footage between that HBO VIdeo release and this new Blu-Ray. The big difference, obviously, is its a 4K digital restoration that will be available in HD.

I know there were two versions from Image and Kino on DVD, but besides the difference in music scores I don't know what the difference is between those two.
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DShepFilm

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Re: Theif of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Dec 28, 2012 1:18 pm

As far as I know, there are three versions of this film. The Image Entertainment version (produced by me) has a pipe organ score by Gaylord Carter, based upon the original cue sheet (which is not the same as the full score by Mortimer Wilson, that has not been recorded, as far as I know).

The Kino version has a small-orchestra score compiled by Rodney Sauer and performed by the Mont Alto Motion Picture Orchestra.

The Photoplay/Cohen version has a large-orchestra score by Carl Davis that mostly derives from works of Rimsky-Korsakov.

All derive from the same 35mm film elements and have excellent picture quality, although there are probably minor differences in tinting (added electronically from a b&w negative source). However, the new Cohen version should be super-excellent as the film was scanned in 4K and received full digital restoration (at fantastic expense).

Although the Photoplay/Cohen version has a longer running time, this is a matter of film speed and not of extra footage.

David Shepard
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Gagman 66

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Re: Theif of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Dec 28, 2012 1:23 pm

BigShot,

:? Well it's not exactly the Photoplay version. It is a new scan put together of two negatives in the Rohauer Archive. Subsequently, re-fitted up with the Carl Davis score from the early 80's. First that I heard that it would be out iin February. That is good news. The current Kino DVD I believe released in 2004 has a Mont Alto Orchestra score. There are a few extra bits and pieces of footage here and there, that were not in the Photoplay presentation.
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Rodney

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Re: Theif of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Dec 28, 2012 2:08 pm

Having prepared a score to the Kino version and then adapting it to the new 4K scan for the Turner Classic Movies festival (which we'll be repeating in San Francisco on February 16), we did notice a few differences. Some scenes are slightly longer or shorter throughout, possibly because of frame-rate changes. One bit of footage that differs: when the slave falls from the giant statue in Kandahar, in the Kino version we do not see him hit the ground (it's implied from a reaction shot), but in the Cohen Collection version we actually see a dummy fall and hit the ground.

The biggest differences come towards the end, where in the assault on Bagdad a lot of the footage ended up in a different order, though I believe that it's about the same amount of footage. Because we're following various different plot threads inside and outside the city, I don't think either version makes more or less sense than the other, they're just different; and it required rearranging our music pretty extensively. Obviously, the upcoming BluRay sticks with the existing Carl Davis score, and therefore uses the same order as the earlier Carl Davis-scored release; and we had to adapt our score to fit for the live performance.

There's a joke at the end of the Kino version where Doug keeps getting interrupted by gratified princes as he's trying to kiss the princess (leading the couple to use the invisibility cloak to escape to the flying carpet), and some of these interruptions are missing in the Photoplay print. It's a minor thing, but it's part of a series of running jokes in the finale of Fairbanks films where something silly interferes with or distracts from the final clinch (viz. the handkerchief stunt in The Mark of Zorro, King Richard yelling in Robin Hood, and Donald Crisp waiting out the kiss in The Black Pirate).

I'd only add that, like the Gaylord Carter score, the Mont Alto score is also based loosely on the original cue sheet, so there's probably some overlap in the music of those versions. I wrote up a short essay on the cue sheet and the Mont Alto score, which is an extra on the Kino DVD and can also be found on the "Recordings" page of our web site if you're curious.
Rodney Sauer
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"Let the Music do the Talking!"
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bigshot

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Re: Theif of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Dec 28, 2012 8:58 pm

Thanks all! This looks like a "must buy"
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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Jan 04, 2013 11:11 pm

Available for pre-order at amazon. Cover art:

Image
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Nosferatu

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostSat Jan 05, 2013 10:25 am

While this looks nice, I'm not sure I'll make the jump. I already have the Kino edition. The DVD version is on preorder for $14.99 on amazon. The two Fairbanks movies that need a better edition in my opinion are Robin Hood and The Three Musketeers.
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Mitch Farish

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostSat Jan 05, 2013 11:01 am

Nosferatu wrote:While this looks nice, I'm not sure I'll make the jump. I already have the Kino edition. The DVD version is on preorder for $14.99 on amazon. The two Fairbanks movies that need a better edition in my opinion are Robin Hood and The Three Musketeers.


I have the Kino deluxe edition with the Mont Alto score, and I will keep it. But I'll be all over the blu-ray when it comes out. To have this masterpiece newly restored and tinted, in 1080p, with the Carl Davis interpolations of Rimsky-Korsakov, is a no-brainer. And yes, Kino, how about upgrading The Three Musketeers?
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Changsham

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostSat Jan 05, 2013 4:09 pm

I have owned just about every version of TOB from crappy VHS, Laser Disc and now KINO DVD. I feel I can replay the entire film in my head and don't need it but I have pre ordered it without hesitation. $20 is nothing to pay for what may be the definitive restoration with the promise of more to come if enought copies are sold. Everyone should get onboard.
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Gagman 66

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostSun Jan 06, 2013 12:16 am

Changman,

:o So is it being released next month? Funny that the print is tinted throughout, but the cover is Mono-chrome?

What is the animal on your Avatar?
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Changsham

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostSun Jan 06, 2013 6:11 am

Gagman 66 wrote:Changman,

:o So is it being released next month? Funny that the print is tinted throughout, but the cover is Mono-chrome?

What is the animal on your Avatar?



The amimal is a friendly tame brush tail possum that visits my garden. Cute and intelligent and nothing like the American possum I believe.
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Gagman 66

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostSun Jan 06, 2013 3:47 pm

Changsham,

:) Cool! Can you post a larger version of the Possum here? He lives in your back yard?
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Changsham

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostSun Jan 06, 2013 10:50 pm

Gagman 66 wrote:Changsham,

:) Cool! Can you post a larger version of the Possum here? He lives in your back yard?


Lives in bushland near by. Visits most nights with a few others for a feed of fruit. Very gentle friendly creatures but not suitable as household pets as they like to climb all over furniture. Make ideal free range pets though. Sometimes these possums will move into roof spaces and attics.
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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostWed Feb 20, 2013 3:33 pm

Interesting that the booklet lists Alice May Wong. The film looks fantastic, though.
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Gagman 66

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostWed Feb 20, 2013 6:11 pm

Changsham,

8) Lo, thanks for the possum! He looks more rodent like all blown up though.

Zoot,

:D Yeah, I got THIEF in the mail this evening! Looking forward to watching it this weekend!
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Matthew White

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostWed Feb 20, 2013 6:48 pm

Had my pre-order in place days ago. Received an email today from Amazon.ca informing me that the bluray was no longer available! They stated that they were unable to get it from their supplier. I sure hope this situation changes!
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Rick Lanham

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostWed Feb 20, 2013 7:25 pm

Mine arrived on Tuesday.

Be prepared for some trailers for other films to play first, just as though you are at the theater, haha.

I was interrupted, so can't give a full report. The music is great. The image didn't overly impress, I'm still entranced by the story and Fairbanks more than the image. I was wishing that my screen was bigger (it's 50"). I've seen the film in a theater, so I guess I was longing for a repeat of that.

Rick
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Gagman 66

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostWed Feb 20, 2013 8:01 pm

Mathew White,

:shock: No longer available? Huh, I got mine from Amazon today.
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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostThu Feb 21, 2013 1:35 am

Changsham,

Sometimes these possums will move into roof spaces and attics.

Come and get mine. You don't live from me. The fights on my roofs and inside the internal roof is maddening. Costs a fortune to get them out and they do bite and scratch. The stink inside the roof can be horrible. Law says you have to let them loose not far from where you catch them. And there is a major fox problem around our area too.

I do prefer the Disney Nature films than have these critters causing havoc.
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Matthew White

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostThu Feb 21, 2013 5:06 am

No longer available? Huh, I got mine from Amazon today.


I think the situation is only effecting Amazon in Canada. Rats!
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bigshot

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostThu Feb 21, 2013 12:52 pm

I watched a bit of this on my ten foot projection system last night. This is a fantastic transfer of a wonderful film. The music, tints, image quality, sound quality... all top notch. My only complaint is about the supplement with the production stills. The photos are incredible, and the music is fun, but why do they leave the title card with text describing the photo up for ten seconds and then just allow the photo itself two seconds?! Totally backwards.
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Rodney

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostTue Feb 26, 2013 2:21 pm

There's a review today in The New York Times. Dave Kehr likes it.
Rodney Sauer
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Roscoe

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostMon Mar 04, 2013 1:43 pm

Worth the wait. Lovely from start to finish. This is one of those movies that I just love pretty much without reservation. I'm so glad to have been able to see it on a fairly large movie screen during the theatrical run. I'd give a lot to have been able to see it at the Castro, but that's life.

And Mr. Davis' score is really something -- one of the very best I know of.
"If you lose this war, don't blame me."

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Arndt

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostMon Mar 04, 2013 1:52 pm

Roscoe wrote:And Mr. Davis' score is really something -- one of the very best I know of.


I just booked my ticket to see Mr Davis conduct his own score for FOUR HORSEMEN with the Luxembourg Philharmonic Orchestra on 4 May. He is the best. May he have many, many more healthy years and give us lots of happiness!
MELIOR
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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostMon Mar 04, 2013 9:51 pm

Arndt wrote:
Roscoe wrote:And Mr. Davis' score is really something -- one of the very best I know of.


I just booked my ticket to see Mr Davis conduct his own score for FOUR HORSEMEN with the Luxembourg Philharmonic Orchestra on 4 May. He is the best. May he have many, many more healthy years and give us lots of happiness!


Arndt, I hate you just a little. :-)
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Arndt

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostTue Mar 05, 2013 5:53 am

rudyfan wrote:
Arndt wrote:
Roscoe wrote:And Mr. Davis' score is really something -- one of the very best I know of.


I just booked my ticket to see Mr Davis conduct his own score for FOUR HORSEMEN with the Luxembourg Philharmonic Orchestra on 4 May. He is the best. May he have many, many more healthy years and give us lots of happiness!


Arndt, I hate you just a little. :-)


I understand. I realize it is a privilege. He comes to Luxembourg once a year to conduct. But hey, in April you can see him conduct for IT in Hollywood.
MELIOR
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Gagman 66

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Mar 08, 2013 4:38 pm

:) A very nice review in TCM Movie News here.

www.tcm.com/this-month/movie-news.html? ... y&banner=1
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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostFri Mar 08, 2013 4:50 pm

I just got mine. It looks GREAT and sounds GREAT. The stills on places like DVDBeaver, which I love, don't do it justice, as images look different in motion. I watch on a 10 foot-wide screen, so imperfections become noticeable, but this one looks great.
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Rick Lanham

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Re: Thief of Bagdad on bluray

PostSat Mar 09, 2013 10:31 am

The Savant review on DVDTalk gives it excellent ratings all around:

http://www.dvdtalk.com/dvdsavant/s4109bagd.html" target="_blank

Rick
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