Tweet Mary Pickford Autograph

I just obtained this autograph (supposedly at least), of Mary Pickford on Ebay a couple of months back. Don't know if it's real or not, as I didn't pay much money for it. It only came on a manilla colored card, with the M & A smudged out. Anyone tell if this is authentic or not please? Thanks.

I've seen samples of her autograph and never noticed any with a period at the end.

I don't know why but I've seen her autograph so many times it looks like a fake to me. There's something not quite right about it and I'm not sure how to describe it.

Here are the Mary Pickford autographs I own if you'd like to compare it to these signatures. I believe all of mine are real.

The first two autographs on index cards are from the collection of a veteran silent movie fan who apparently used to write the stars repeatedly during the 1970's and 1980's, when he died his estate sold them in batches of a dozen or so on ebay ten years ago. Note he stamped the date he received the first index card.

The photo is apparently the picture Mary would send to fans during the early 1960's, the white block on the bottom left is printed on the photo for her to sign in a clear area. It's dated 1961.

The bottom signature is handed dated by the previous owner September 1, 1939 and was an apparent autograph book page that they later glued to cardboard.


I think the signature you have looks a little too "hard" for Mary's handwriting but it might be real. If I were you, I would post a scan on one of the autograph collecting sites for opinions by expert collectors. It's rumored that Buddy signed for Mary a lot in the late 1970's.

Here's mine.



I'm no expert, but to me the loops in the "M" "y" and "f" look wrong.. actually ALL of it looks off.

Aside from just comparing real samples, it's important to look at the way the name has been formed on the paper. Hold it up to the light, look at the impressions the pen has made, and the way any ink has bled through to the underside. Are there pressure points in places where someone wouldn't naturally rest their pen? Have the letters been formed as someone writing their name in a hurry would form them, with heavier downstrokes and lighter upstrokes? On that last point, the 'k' in 'Pickford' is a concern. There would be no good reason to write a k like that.

Hmm.

I distrust the '70's / '80's ones as well.

Notice in the earlier ones that she's "dotted" the "i" in "Pickford" with a big circle which sits right on top of the "P". In the later signatures, I suspect someone has seen that, not understood what it was, and translated it into that weird little wiggle in the "P."

Or she could have just been drinking a lot that day...

I expect signatures to change somewhat over time, though the general form of it will have links to the past. Finding an old signature of mine was a surprise, as it was similar but much less free. I saw a Nancy Carroll that looked like a first place winner for a penmanship prize, very precise.

I haven't seen enough Pickfords here to even hazard a guess.

I've handled hundreds of signed Mary Pickford documents over the years, so I'll offer my opinion.

The signature provided in the original post doesn't appear close to the Pickford signature as I know it. Nor does it follow the Pickford signature of Esther Helm (Pickford's personal secretary for over twenty years) or her husband Charles "Buddy" Rogers.

Pickford, as a tribute to her origins, always created a "S" (for "Smith") when curving the "P" in "Pickford".

Hope this helps.

Jeffrey Vance

So that circle I was reading as a large dot on the "i" is really the upper loop of an "S"? That's interesting! Thank you.

Hmm.

I distrust the '70's / '80's ones as well.

Notice in the earlier ones that she's "dotted" the "i" in "Pickford" with a big circle which sits right on top of the "P". In the later signatures, I suspect someone has seen that, not understood what it was, and translated it into that weird little wiggle in the "P."

Or she could have just been drinking a lot that day...

I wouldn't trust any 80's ones either given she died in 1979.

The signatures I proved come from quite a gap, 1939, 1961, and 1975 and a person's handwriting can change quite a bit over such a period. The "weird little wiggle" in the P is very common in Pickford signatures late 60s/70s whether it's her actual handwriting or not. I am hoping my 70's are real but given she did have others sign for her at times I'm not positive.

I've handled hundreds of signed Mary Pickford documents over the years, so I'll offer my opinion.

The signature provided in the original post doesn't appear close to the Pickford signature as I know it. Nor does it follow the Pickford signature of Esther Helm (Pickford's personal secretary for over twenty years) or her husband Charles "Buddy" Rogers.

Pickford, as a tribute to her origins, always created a "S" (for "Smith") when curving the "P" in "Pickford".

Hope this helps.

Jeffrey Vance

Do you think my 70's ones are legit or signed by Esther or Buddy? I know they came correspondence sent to Pickfair at least.

I wouldn't trust any 80's ones either given she died in 1979.

Can you show the reverse side of the card?

Also, was this signed with a ball point type pen? If so, there should be a crease where the ink lays.

What color is the ink?

I am not sure of the history of permanent marker but certain types were made in certain eras.

Did the seller indicate what year the signature originated?

All of the above will help in authenticating such an item. But be warned however that most autographs on eBay are forgeries.

Thank you for all your opinions. There doesn't seem to be any bleeding through the back of the card except for that smudge mark. It actually looks like it was written with a felt tip marker, almost like a purple sharpie? Included a picture of the back of the card, as requested. The person did not indicate the year of signing. I'm leaning more towards a fake, so thankfully, I didn't pay much for it.

If I were you, I would post a scan on one of the autograph collecting sites for opinions by expert collectors. It's rumored that Buddy signed for Mary a lot in the late 1970's.

Could you suggest a place please???

I have a number of autographs in my collection you can see here

http://www.211university.ca/items.php?t ... &cat_id=35

the third one top row, is her personal bank card and has the best dusplay

I have a number of autographs in my collection you can see here

http://www.211university.ca/items.php?t ... &cat_id=35" target="_blank

the third one top row, is her personal bank card and has the best dusplay

Thank you. I think I can say, mine is fake? Beautiful collection by the way.

I have a number of autographs in my collection you can see here

http://www.211university.ca/items.php?t ... &cat_id=35" target="_blank" target="_blank

the third one top row, is her personal bank card and has the best dusplay

Thank you. I think I can say, mine is fake? Beautiful collection by the way.

I think just check into it a little more, you never know. It certainly does look fake but I'm not an expert on autographs, I'm just going by what I've seen before. I think you should get ahold of someone in person, a person who specializes in autographs and let them get a look at it.

I'm not gonna totally give up hope just yet. thanks again for all your opinions.

I'm not gonna totally give up hope just yet. thanks again for all your opinions.

I am not sure when fine point felt tipped pens originated but I bet they might not go back further than the 1960s.

I'm not gonna totally give up hope just yet. thanks again for all your opinions.

I am not sure when fine point felt tipped pens originated but I bet they might not go back further than the 1960s.

According to this site: http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blpen.htm - and who knows how accurate it is - they were invented in the 40s but used mainly by artists, but a practical version for general use didn't come out until the 60s.

My mother was a commercial artist in the 60s and I used to play with her equipment when I was a kid. She didn't have anything that resembled a felt tip pen of today.

All this talk of Mary Pickford reminded me of an item I picked up about 15 years ago and I was always curious to know whether it was genuine or not. I have always had doubts about whether it's an actual signature but seeing a close up of the scan reveals it's printed, still it looks like a nice item. Anybody know anything about it?

I'm in Australia and Hoyts is a local cinema chain.

These are "stamped" autographs, done by the studio. I have tons of these, in fact they are a separate section on my site, the link is below

The dots indicate it is printed by printing press. LIthograph or whatever. Mass produced for the fans. Neat item, however. I'd find a nice frame for it.

Thanks for those replies. I knew I'd get the answers here!