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LAistory: Who Killed William Desmond Taylor?

Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:21 pm
by silentfilm
http://laist.com/2009/03/07/laistory_wi ... taylor.php

LAistory: Who Killed William Desmond Taylor?


William Desmond TaylorWilliam Desmond Taylor lived the kind of life that would be tough to live today, in our era of numbers and cards and facial recognition software. In the end, he paid a steep price for that life and so did Hollywood. Maybe he even lived many lives.

He was an antiques dealer, panned for gold, he spent time in either the British or Canadian armies during World War I. He was from Ireland, but he easily morphed into a genteel English gentleman.

Not everything he did was so exciting. He was also an inveterate liar, a deadbeat dad who abandoned his family and a drifter. Like many who flocked to Hollywood in its scandal-free salad days, he invented himself every day.

William Desmond Taylor was born William Cunningham Deane-Tanner on April 26 in Carlow, Ireland. The year is in dispute, though Wikipedia lists it as 1872. When he was 18, he emigrated to the U.S., settling in New York City, where he tried to be an actor and married Ethel May Harrison. He was occasionally subject to some sort of mental lapses where he would just disappear. There is a medical condition where this is known to happen, but it could have just been a clever cover up for his many affairs.

This is what his family thought had happened in 1912, when Taylor vanished, turning up in Los Angeles, replete with his new name and English accent. (Taylor was not the only Tanner to pull this stunt; his brother vanished, abandoning his family as well.)



Henry PeavyWith a change of scene, Taylor’s acting career took off, but before long, he was directing. His first film was The Awakening in 1914. Before he returned to Britain in 1918 (where he joined the Royal Army Service Core (or possibly the Canadian army) to fight in World War I at the age of 46), he made more than fifty films, many starring greats of the age, including Mary Pickford, Constance Talmadge and George Beban. Even as things began to work out, he continued to lie. He told people he had once spent three months in jail for the woman he loved. He cast aspersions on the mental states of many of his high profile friends.

Taylor had his kindnesses as well. When his ex-wife tracked him down (or rather, saw him on a movie screen), he began a relationship with his daughter and made her his heir. When his brother’s family turned up on his doorstep penniless, he promised to pay them fifty dollars a month until his death. He was very worried about his friend, actress Mabel Normand, who was getting increasingly involved with drugs. He picked a fight with her drug dealers.

He got pretty lucky. But luck in this town can run out fast. Taylor was found dead in his Westlake Park bungalow on the morning of February 2, 1922. From the start, the investigation was a circus. Before the police arrived, a crowd of people descended on the place. A man who said he was a doctor examined the body, declaring that Taylor had died of a stomach hemorrhage. Had this “doctor” decided to turn the body over, he would have discovered the fatal bullet wound in Taylor’s back. Authorities never found the man. There are rumors that an entire troop of people from Paramount came through, removing objects that might have been key in the investigation, including ladies lingerie, all of Taylor’s illegal booze and any letters.

Some things were still evident. Taylor still had a two carat diamond ring, all the cash in his wallet and his pocket watch (among other things). However, there was evidence that Taylor had taken a substantial amount of money from his bank a few days before and that was never found.



Mary Miles MinterThere are probably more theories as to who killed Taylor than there are lives he lived. Among the suspects were both of his butlers. The first was a man named Edward Sands, who was working under an alias (and a fake cockney accent) who stole money from Taylor and ran off. Some people though that he killed him because he was his brother, Denis Deane-Tanner, bearing a grudge over a stolen fiancé. The other butler (who found Taylor prone on his living room floor) was Henry Peavy.

Peavy had been previously charged with indecent exposure, but this could have meant a number of things less pervy than the words connote - like gay cruising or having to resort to peeing al fresco after not being allowed in a whites only bathroom. Because of the charge, it’s been speculated that Peavy was Taylor’s lover, or was, perhaps procuring boys for him. One enterprising reporter decided he was guilty and took him to a cemetery where a co-conspirator jumped out from behind a gravestone in a sheet and accused him of the crime. Investigative reporting at its best!

A bevy of actresses were also accused, among them Taylor’s protégé, Mary Miles Minter, and her mother. Mary was sixteen, but she’d already been working for years at the behest of her showbiz mom, Charlotte Shelby. At 8, she was playing sixteen. She was in love with Taylor, and may have killed him out of jealousy. Her mother was a suspect because she may have been angry at him for having an affair (that was never confirmed) with her daughter. The ensuing scandal destroyed Minter’s career, but she never gave it a second thought because she hated being an actress anyway.



Mabel NormandAnother suspect was Mabel Normand, who may have been having an affair with Taylor. She was the last to see him alive the night before he died. She was known as the “female Charlie Chaplin.” She starred in a bunch of Keystone Kops films and did a few with Fatty Arbuckle as well. The police eventually declared her innocent, but there were still rumors that her former fiancé, Mac Sennett or her drug dealers had offed him.

There was a theory involving an old army buddy of Taylor’s, and even a hitman (which could have been anyone.) So soon after the Fatty Arbuckle scandal, people began to see Hollywood as a den of sin. The studios responded by putting morals clauses into their contracts. We were out of Eden.

Though there are still avid conspiracy theorists, most people haven’t heard of William Desmond Taylor, though his death contributed to the way our city and its premiere industry is still seen today. Most of his films are gone, vanished in the river of time. The theories are nearly all we have left and they are all deeply flawed, stories like the ones Taylor told himself and others. There’s only one thing that remains certain, in the midst of all the rumors, innuendo, lies and obfuscations, Taylor died as he lived, one foot in the mist.

LAistory is our series that takes us on a journey to what came before to help us understand where we are today.

Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:50 pm
by FrankFay
Honestly- by this time I don't give a damm who killed him.

Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:06 pm
by WaverBoy
I do. This unsolved Hollywood murder mystery is much too fascinating for film buff apathy. Ever since I read (the admittedly badly flawed) A CAST OF KILLERS, I've been thoroughly intrigued.

Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:15 pm
by misspickford9
It is quite intriguing...mainly because there really does not seem to be an answer almost 90 some years later.

That being said the article is blah...that guy just basically combined a bunch of wikipedia articles together. Mabel was never even remotely a suspect. Hard to kill someone when your seen leaving...

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 9:43 am
by Chris Snowden
misspickford9 wrote:That being said the article is blah...that guy just basically combined a bunch of wikipedia articles together. Mabel was never even remotely a suspect. Hard to kill someone when your seen leaving...
Actually, Peavey told police he believed that Mabel Normand was the most likely killer. And she's the only person in this cast of characters known to be involved in a subsequent shooting (Courtland Dines, only a couple of years later).

I don't think she killed Taylor, though.

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:14 am
by misspickford9
Chris Snowden wrote:
misspickford9 wrote:That being said the article is blah...that guy just basically combined a bunch of wikipedia articles together. Mabel was never even remotely a suspect. Hard to kill someone when your seen leaving...
Actually, Peavey told police he believed that Mabel Normand was the most likely killer. And she's the only person in this cast of characters known to be involved in a subsequent shooting (Courtland Dines, only a couple of years later).

I don't think she killed Taylor, though.
Yeaaaah but that second shooting had nothing to do with anything. It was at a party full of people and by her crazed chauffer, its not like she shot someone up or anything. Mabel had a very bad stroke of luck even when press fluff is accounted for. I dont recall that of Peavey but even if he believed it its still EXTREMLY unlikely. Heck its more likely Peavey did him in (though Im not a fan of that theory myself) then Mabel!

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:31 am
by Chris Snowden
misspickford9 wrote:Yeaaaah but that second shooting had nothing to do with anything. It was at a party full of people and by her crazed chauffer, its not like she shot someone up or anything. Mabel had a very bad stroke of luck even when press fluff is accounted for.
The Dines case is almost as interesting as the Taylor case, if you look into it. That party consisted of only three people, one of whom was the victim.

Mabel's chauffeur didn't shoot Dines. He was presented to the police as the shooter after the participants had had a chance to work up a plausible scenario. Unfortunately, those participants were fully loaded from their all-night New Years celebration, and what seemed plausible at the time fell apart very quickly.

Greer the chauffeur was found not guilty in court, in spite of the confession that he'd helpfully provided, leaving Mabel and the battery of lawyers she'd paid for to squirm while the judge issued some pointed words. He hadn't been fooled for a minute.

Dines himself refused to press any charges (he'd even resisted police efforts to get him to a hospital that morning), so the matter pretty much stopped right there. Mabel's luck wasn't so bad after all.

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 12:16 pm
by Frederica
Now I'm interested.
Chris Snowden wrote:Mabel's chauffeur didn't shoot Dines. He was presented to the police as the shooter after the participants had had a chance to work up a plausible scenario. Unfortunately, those participants were fully loaded from their all-night New Years celebration, and what seemed plausible at the time fell apart very quickly.

Greer the chauffeur was found not guilty in court, in spite of the confession that he'd helpfully provided, leaving Mabel and the battery of lawyers she'd paid for to squirm while the judge issued some pointed words. He hadn't been fooled for a minute.
And apparently neither was the jury, but was any forensic evidence presented?

Fred

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 2:27 pm
by Frederica
Chris Snowden wrote: Greer the chauffeur was found not guilty in court, in spite of the confession that he'd helpfully provided, leaving Mabel and the battery of lawyers she'd paid for to squirm while the judge issued some pointed words. He hadn't been fooled for a minute.
OK, so I went and looked myself. And my, my, my, look at who her lawyer was. Milton Cohen, Attorney to the Stars. My, my, my.

Fred

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 3:41 pm
by Chris Snowden
Frederica wrote:OK, so I went and looked myself. And my, my, my, look at who her lawyer was. Milton Cohen, Attorney to the Stars. My, my, my.
I think we've found your next project!

I haven't dug into the Dines case in years, but the most helpful material I found back then was at Bruce Long's Taylorology site, so I guess it's still there. The Betty Fussell book wasn't very useful.

What happened in a nutshell was that Mabel, her friend Edna Purviance and Edna's boyfriend Courtland Dines were all together in the same apartment, winding down after a long New Year's Eve. Dines was shot, bloodily but not seriously. Whodunit?

Dines might have just shot himself, and his actions afterward suggest the likelihood of being tremendously embarrassed about the whole thing. But it's unlikely, as he had no reason to do so. And if the gun had been in his own hand, he would probably have fired a direct hit into himself, rather than grazing himself with a couple of flesh wounds.

Edna might have pulled the trigger, and I can imagine a tipsy Dines getting shot for flirting with the tipsy gal-pal of his tipsy girlfriend. But that's not really consistent with what we know about Edna's lifestyle. She seems to have lived pretty quietly during her Hollywood years (and certainly afterwards), and to my knowledge she never said or did anything that would suggest a guilty conscience, or an effort to cover something up.

Which brings us to the person who did have a rambunctious reputation. Mabel later injured herself after horseback-riding while drunk; she suddenly married Lew Cody while in a similar condition, much to the surprise of her friends.

There are inconsistencies between the account that Mabel told the authorities about the Dines shooting, and what she told a Liberty Magazine interviewer about it in 1930. Bizarrely, she told the police that the shooting happened while her back was turned, and that she didn't even turn around at the sound of the gunshots because she thought they were firecrackers instead, an explanation that deserves its own display case at the Lame Excuse Hall of Fame.

The idea that Dines was shot by Mabel's crazy chauffeur doesn't make much more sense. He didn't strike anybody afterward as being unhinged, or love-struck, or anything else, although it did strike people as odd that a supposedly crazed gunman should be so eager to confess, to the extent of running to the police station to turn himself in. It's also strange that such a dangerous, violent character should be represented in court by a team of lawyers hired by Mabel herself. It's almost as if the low-paid chauffeur had made an attractive deal with Mabel to take the fall himself, as long as he wouldn't have to serve any hard time for it. And in the end he never did, but only because no one in the courtroom believed the story that he'd shot Dines. Case dismissed.

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:24 pm
by misspickford9
Very interesting! Whichever the other case I still am not convinced Mabel is a viable suspect for Taylor though.

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:40 pm
by Bruce Long
Chris Snowden wrote:...Mabel's chauffeur didn't shoot Dines. He was presented to the police as the shooter after the participants had had a chance to work up a plausible scenario...Greer the chauffeur was found not guilty in court, in spite of the confession that he'd helpfully provided...
I always assumed that Greer did indeed shoot Dines. I thought Greer had been charged with "assault with intent to do great bodily harm", and was acquitted because there was reasonable doubt as to whether it was self-defense (Dines was supposedly about to throw a bottle at him).

But I never really looked into it, aside from that bunch of clippings I gathered and posted in Taylorology.

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 4:18 pm
by Ballyhoo Beau
I always thought the Dines Shooting was pretty straight forward too. Just a fight gone horribly wrong.

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 9:41 pm
by The Blackbird
Okay, I confess.

Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 11:35 am
by sepiatone
I heard(actually read) it was Charlotte Shelby(mother of Mary Miles Minter), and is supported by strong circumstantial evidence. Circumstantial because the alledged reason for Shelby shooting Taylor was that Taylor was having a sexual affair with Minter. But why for mother Shelby to shoot him? Minter many years before as an underage teenager had an affair with much older James Kirkwood who impregnated her and Mrs Shelby didn't go after Kirkwood. Either Mrs. Shelby didn't know about MMM's Kirkwood related pregnancy or went to lengths covering it up and keeping it out of the press.

Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 11:48 am
by FrankFay
It sounds as if you read A CAST OF KILLERS. The theory in that book has holes big enough to drive a bus through.

Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 11:57 am
by sepiatone
FrankFay wrote:It sounds as if you read A CAST OF KILLERS. The theory in that book has holes big enough to drive a bus through.
and watched some tv stuff. It's all circumstantial. I don't think that murder will ever be solved. At one time I thought it might've been Taylor's wife that he ran out on when he was still William Dean Tanner. She'd certainly have motif. Then there's the silent screen actress who supposedly made a death bed confession to the murder in 1964. But I don't count on this crime ever being solved. Too much time. Too much cop bungling in 1922 and on.

Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 6:10 pm
by salus
This murder case was the Whodunnit of the Film Industry just as JFK's was the Whodunnit of Politics. There are so many angles to this tale, the drug angle, the smitten ingenue, the homosexual butler angle, the druggie silent star mabel normand, the angry and jealous mother of MMM, Desmond Taylor's strange past with his wife,the crazed silent actress's deathbed confession,possible payoffs to LA police officials all in a stew pot being stirred by the Hollywood Hierarchy who was trying to keep it all from spilling over and destroying their industry. After this happened all the players in this drama went downhill.

Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 8:17 pm
by missdupont
We don't need to go over all this again ad nauseum. Here is the previous post where it was discussed in minute detail:

http://www.nitrateville.com/viewtopic.p ... tte+shelby

Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 8:28 pm
by sepiatone
MissDupont
thanks for that link, keep in mind some of us newbies weren't on N'ville a year ago 'run-around' topicality is bound to come up. :wink: But if and when this murder is solved I think it will be someone amongst the kaleidoscope of characters mentioned. :)

Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 10:32 am
by salus
This has always been an interesting topic. Whodunnits usually are. Mary Miles Minters statement to King Vidor in the 1960s that her mother killed everythin i loved could refer to her sister, her career and William Desmond Taylor . It proably doesn't include Marys only husband who she married later maybe her mom kept them apart except for business until Marys mom was too old and bedridden to stop it. I believe Mary married a couple of years before her mom died and he outlived the mom by a few years but i believe their friendship went back quite aways. Marys mom might have still been trouble for her but they did reconcile maybe thats when she let her marry. What would interest me would be to know Marys mom's reaction when Mary gave up her lucrative film career , i doubt she was happy they were already fighting over Marys previous earnings.

Posted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 1:16 am
by Bob Birchard
sepiatone wrote:I heard(actually read) it was Charlotte Shelby(mother of Mary Miles Minter), and is supported by strong circumstantial evidence. Circumstantial because the alledged reason for Shelby shooting Taylor was that Taylor was having a sexual affair with Minter. But why for mother Shelby to shoot him? Minter many years before as an underage teenager had an affair with much older James Kirkwood who impregnated her and Mrs Shelby didn't go after Kirkwood. Either Mrs. Shelby didn't know about MMM's Kirkwood related pregnancy or went to lengths covering it up and keeping it out of the press.
While there can be little doubt that Mabel shot Courtland Dines, the case against her for bumping off Taylor is much more circumstantial, and not particularly compelling. After having read Bruce Long's "William Desmond Taylor: A Dossier," which compiles all or most of the earlier issues of Taylorology, the only conclusion one can reasonably reach is that William Desmond Taylor met his death at the hands of another peron or persons unknown. This is why I am so intrigued by the Margaret Gibson/Patricia Palmer confession. She had worked with Taylor, had a shady and rather seedy bacground, and felt compelled to leave the country for a time. Since it was impossible to finger any of the "usual suspects," it seems likely that whoever did the deed was not in Taylor's immediate circle--in other words a virtual unknown. The death bed confession is the clincher. While we've all heard of loonies who confess to crimes they didn't commit, in the eyes of the law a deathbed confession is considered proof of guilt. Admittedly, the deathbed confesion is heresay. We only have the word of the surviving witness; but in the absence of a better candidate I opt for Gibson/Palmer.

Posted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 1:29 am
by Bob Birchard
salus wrote:This has always been an interesting topic. Whodunnits usually are. Mary Miles Minters statement to King Vidor in the 1960s that her mother killed everythin i loved could refer to her sister, her career and William Desmond Taylor . It proably doesn't include Marys only husband who she married later maybe her mom kept them apart except for business until Marys mom was too old and bedridden to stop it. I believe Mary married a couple of years before her mom died and he outlived the mom by a few years but i believe their friendship went back quite aways. Marys mom might have still been trouble for her but they did reconcile maybe thats when she let her marry. What would interest me would be to know Marys mom's reaction when Mary gave up her lucrative film career , i doubt she was happy they were already fighting over Marys previous earnings.
Mary was always telling people she wouldn't talk about the Taylor murder, and then wouldn't talk about anything else, but it was certainly clear to me when i knew her that she never seriously thought her mother killed Taylor. I always felt it suited Mary's purpose to seem sort of crazy and self-deluded--it made folks underestimate her. While it is true that Mary was something of a romantic and in her younger years was seemingly obsessed with father figures, that was only one part of Mary. She was very shrewd in business, though as nails, and absolutely iron-willed. She was demanding, though not necesarily unpleasant--just difficult--and she was very used to having her own way. Don't let the curls fool you--Mary was tough and smart, and talked about Taylor because that's what her audience wanted to hear--even though I don't think she eve knew much more that what everybody else read in the papers on the subject.

Posted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 9:56 am
by salus
Mary had the iron willed personality of her mother, you can tell by that audio of her on youtube. Yes Mary was shrewd in business and didn't leave Hollywood emptyhanded. I believe her sister proably was the real victim having to deal with these 2 strong ladies. As for the Gibson/Palmer thesis i wonder if anybody has checked that day if she was on a set doing a movie or her whereabouts. I doubt it bec ause her confession was 40 years after the deadly deed. By the way where did that rumor start that Marys mom didn't die in 1957 but was sort of bedridden and living upstairs in her room till the mid 1960s?

Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 4:45 am
by T0m M
Bob Birchard wrote:... The death bed confession is the clincher. While we've all heard of loonies who confess to crimes they didn't commit, in the eyes of the law a deathbed confession is considered proof of guilt. Admittedly, the deathbed confesion is heresay. We only have the word of the surviving witness; but in the absence of a better candidate I opt for Gibson/Palmer.
Make that two, alledged confessions. In his book Stardust and Shadows, Charles Foster claims that Mack Sennett admitted to the murder during a drunken, 1959 interview witnessed by Reece Halsey. He also cites a prior interview with Marshall Neilan who claims he was convinced that Sennett was about to confess to the murder when their conversation was interupted by a visitor.

Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 4:56 am
by FrankFay
T0m M wrote:
Bob Birchard wrote:... The death bed confession is the clincher. While we've all heard of loonies who confess to crimes they didn't commit, in the eyes of the law a deathbed confession is considered proof of guilt. Admittedly, the deathbed confesion is heresay. We only have the word of the surviving witness; but in the absence of a better candidate I opt for Gibson/Palmer.
Make that two, alledged confessions. In his book Stardust and Shadows, Charles Foster claims that Mack Sennett admitted to the murder during a drunken, 1959 interview witnessed by Reece Halsey. He also cites a prior interview with Marshall Neilan who claims he was convinced that Sennett was about to confess to the murder when their conversation was interupted by a visitor.
probably Ralph Edwards inviting Sennett out to dinner.

Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 8:24 am
by Bob Birchard
T0m M wrote:
Bob Birchard wrote:... The death bed confession is the clincher. While we've all heard of loonies who confess to crimes they didn't commit, in the eyes of the law a deathbed confession is considered proof of guilt. Admittedly, the deathbed confesion is heresay. We only have the word of the surviving witness; but in the absence of a better candidate I opt for Gibson/Palmer.
Make that two, alledged confessions. In his book Stardust and Shadows, Charles Foster claims that Mack Sennett admitted to the murder during a drunken, 1959 interview witnessed by Reece Halsey. He also cites a prior interview with Marshall Neilan who claims he was convinced that Sennett was about to confess to the murder when their conversation was interupted by a visitor.
In law a drunken confession by an otherwise halke and hearty sould would not have the same weight as a deathbed confession. I suppose the link with Sennett might be that Sennett was in love with Normand, Normand was seeing Taylor, Sennett went into a jealous rage and shot Taylor in the back . . . I suppose it could happen, but I'm not convinced.

Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 2:03 pm
by T0m M
Bob Birchard wrote:In law a drunken confession by an otherwise halke and hearty sould would not have the same weight as a deathbed confession. I suppose the link with Sennett might be that Sennett was in love with Normand, Normand was seeing Taylor, Sennett went into a jealous rage and shot Taylor in the back . . . I suppose it could happen, but I'm not convinced.
I wasn't implying that Mack was the real murderer, only that there was record of another confession.

Reece is said to have specifically asked Sennett why he killed Taylor and the reply was, " Because he was a bloody queer and stole Mabel by giving her drugs."

Neilan is quoted as having said, "Dozens of us believed it was Mack but we all hated Taylor and loved Mack so nobody even hinted this to the investigators."

Again, I'm not making any judgement on this, only reporting some information from a source of which many forum memebrs may not have been aware.

Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 3:00 pm
by spadeneal
Mabel Normand was called "the female Charlie Chaplin"?? I'm sure that would be news to Mabel. Never heard of that.

spadeneal

Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 5:21 pm
by Gagman 66
spadeneal,

I have. Normand was frequently called "The Female Chaplin". Why you have not heard this is beyond me. I first read it in YESTERDAY'S CLOWN'S some 30 years ago. It is also part of the basis for my labeling of Colleen Moore as "The Female Harold Lloyd".