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The Criterion Collection announced that "Modern Times" will be a November release (and it seems it will be released during the time B&N has their November Criterion Collection 50% off sale):

[img]http://criterion_production.s3.amazonaws.com/release_images/3058/543_BD_box_348x490.jpg[/img]


* United States
* 1936
* 87 minutes
* Black and White
* 1.33:1
* English


SYNOPSIS: Modern Times, Charlie Chaplin’s last outing as the Little Tramp, puts the iconic character to work as a giddily inept factory employee who becomes smitten with a gorgeous gamine (Paulette Goddard). With its barrage of unforgettable gags and sly commentary on class struggle during the Great Depression, Modern Times—though made almost a decade into the talkie era and containing moments of sound (even song!)—is a timeless showcase of Chaplin’s untouchable genius as a director of silent comedy.

* New, restored high-definition digital transfer, with uncompressed monaural soundtrack on the Blu-ray edition
* New audio commentary by Chaplin biographer David Robinson
* Two new visual essays, by Chaplin historians John Bengtson and Jeffrey Vance
* New program on the film’s visual and sound effects, with experts Craig Barron and Ben Burtt
* Interview from 1992 with Modern Times music arranger David Raksin
* Chaplin Today: “Modern Times” (2004), a half-hour program with filmmakers Luc and Jean-Pierre Dardenne
* Two segments removed from the film
* Three theatrical trailers
* All at Sea (1933), a home movie by Alistair Cooke featuring Charlie Chaplin, Paulette Goddard, and Cooke, plus a new score by Donald Sosin and a new interview with Cooke’s daughter, Susan Cooke Kittredge
* The Rink (1916), a Chaplin two-reeler highlighting his skill on wheels
* For the First Time (1967), a Cuban documentary short about a projectionist who shows Modern Times to first-time moviegoers
* More!
* PLUS: A booklet featuring an essay by film critic Saul Austerlitz and a piece by film scholar Lisa Stein that includes excerpts from Chaplin’s writing about his travels in 1931 and 1932

Very unispired and unappealing artwork.

It appears this will be the cut reissue version, as the extras include "sequences removed from the film"; if this is the case, I'll stick with the uncut-as-originally-approved-by-the-director-for-its-original-theatrical-release version on the old Image DVD. I have no use for the cut version, however much better visually it may be (and the old DVD still looks just fine). A pity that an opportunity for a complete hi-def version of MODERN TIMES has apparently been squandered. I'm expecting the rest of the films that were cut for reissue to be similarly cut here as well, most likely because of dictates from the Chaplin Estate, and if so, I'll be similarly avoiding them. Looks like I'll be able to upgrade THE GREAT DICTATOR, MONSIEUR VERDOUX and LIMELIGHT, and THE GOLD RUSH if a hi-def version of the Brownlow/Gill restoration of the real film is included, and maybe CITY LIGHTS if they use a full aperture transfer. (That is, if these aren't digitally overscrubbed ghosted transfers from shoddy PAL-to-NTSC conversions like the botched WB/M2K DVDs, but it's Criterion, so I would hope they wouldn't stand for such nonsense.) I might upgrade THE CIRCUS, but I do prefer the Shepard version without the opening Chaplin song over footage that occurs later in the film. At any rate, the First National shorts, THE KID, A WOMAN OF PARIS, MODERN TIMES and A KING IN NEW YORK will most likely all be missing footage available in previous releases, and if so, that's a cryin' shame. MODERN TIMES suffers the worst from being cut, as the final verse of the nonsense song is absolute prime Chaplin, and without it the scene ends like someone edited it with a chainsaw. Call it ungrateful quibbling if you like, but for this Chaplin fan, it's a deal-breaker.

OK, I'll throw in a qualified quibble: I agree about the uninspired artwork, altered from a photo of the Tramp from way before MODERN TIMES was ever thought of. But I wouldn't care if Criterion presented the film uncut, and would shower them with praise for doing it right, and willingly throw my money at them with a huge smile on my face.

Speedy,

What a downer! I was hoping we could count on Criterion to finally get these right. Apparently it isn't going to happen? And what about THE GOLD RUSH? The only way to get that right is present a new restoration of the 1925 version with Orchestra, and hopefully an Alternate track of the re-mastered Bill Perry score, or better yet Perry's score re-recorded with orchestra. Sorry Charlie, I love your music, but Perry's score has you beat by a mile. That won't happen because Neil Brand's Piano score has replaced Perry's, despite there being no comparison between the two. And yes, Carl Davis put together a hybrid score back in 1999, from the 1942 re-issue music, and the original cues from the 1925 New York Premier. The complete score on Paper was uncovered in Chaplin's vault in 1991. Will never get to hear that either.

The 87 minute listed run time seems to match the Image DVD run time and not the cut version I have which runs 84 minutes. Here's hoping the Criterion disc is the original release as I won't buy another cut version.

If the cut version you have is the WB/MK2 DVD release, then it runs 84 minutes because it's been (shoddily) converted from a PAL source, and PAL sources have been sped up by 4% because they run at 25fps. The running time of the cut version runs only 30 seconds less than the uncut version (albeit 30 extremely valuable seconds) and was always listed as 87 minutes as well. I'm going by the extras listing, and the fact that the Chaplin Estate has gone on the record saying the the versions cut by Chaplin for reissue DECADES after their original theatrical release are the "official" versions henceforth. Thank the gods the good Shepard was able to make them come to their senses for at least one DVD release of these films. Those Image DVDs are only continuing to grow in value.

Having to release the cut version of Modern Times must have been a mandate from the Chaplin estate and not a decision by the folks at the Criterion Collection. It's a pity, and unfortunately it's the wretched 1942 GOLD RUSH as part of the Janus Films theatrical tour, so it appears the Chaplin Estate is just being stubborn about what they will allow to be distributed. It doesn't make a lick of sense, but there it is.

I never expected anything but the "daddy" versions to come out from Criterion. A great shame, and it's not their fault, but much as I'd like the blu-rays, I'll stick to my uncut Image versions. It wouldn't hurt to send a polite note to Criterion, explaining why you won't buy the cut versions...they just might inform the Estate that sales are down from what they might be. Probably won't help, but.....it can't hurt.

While the Harold Lloyd Trust strove to give us more, and restore long unseen footage, the Chaplin Heir's by stark contrast are content to butcher the films. Sickening and disgusting. They do Charlie a real disservice with their apparent stupidity. Everyone want's the most complete version of every single film. That's the whole idea, behind restorations. That's the whole notion behind DVD, and Blu-ray. Curse them! Where do we publicly protest this atrocity???? Send the Hier's this entire thread. And every other negative response and make them choke on it!!!.

Gagman 66 wrote:Curse them! Where do we publicly protest this atrocity???? Send the Hier's this entire thread. And every other negative response and make them choke on it!!!.

Umm, you might keep the polite idea in mind when you contact them...

Gagman - how do you really feel? - however, I agree with you. Perhaps an email to Criterion's Jon Mulvaney would help

[email protected]

he may at least be able to answer the "cut" question

Thanks for the address. I just emailed Mr. Mulvaney with my concerns, politely and respectfully, and I encourage others interested in uncut releases of these films to do the same. As Danny said, it certainly can't hurt.

Gosh -- am I the only one who likes the artwork?

Many of the extras look like they've been carried over from the WB/MK2 release of MODERN TIMES, and if that's the case, the "deleted" scenes are two sequences cut from the film BEFORE its release in 1936 -- and are very much worth having. So let's not panic before we have to.

Gagman 66 wrote: While the Harold Lloyd Trust strove to give us more, and restore long unseen footage, the Chaplin Heir's by stark contrast are content to butcher the films. Sickening and disgusting. They do Charlie a real disservice with their apparent stupidity. Everyone want's the most complete version of every single film. That's the whole idea, behind restorations. That's the whole notion behind DVD, and Blu-ray. Curse them! Where do we publicly protest this atrocity???? Send the Hier's this entire thread. And every other negative response and make them choke on it!!!.

To be fair, however regrefully misguided they may be, they don't think they're doing Charlie a disservice; on the contrary, they think that he wanted them to remain that way for all time, because he cut them himself for reissue, and that they're honoring his wishes by releasing them like this. It was Charlie that butchered them, according to his tastes much later in his life. Their hearts are in the right place, but the Estate should realize that the original versions of these films need to be available as well, to the fans and film scholars, for the sake of film history. And for the sake of increased sales figures, because if the affected films are released cut again, they can be sure that the word will be out on all applicable online film forums that the fans' cash will be much better spent on the used Image DVDs from Amazon sellers, which are going for not much above Criterion retail prices. Likewise, if the Estate reconsiders, and if the transfers are up to snuff, I'll shout praises from the rooftops and gladly throw my money at them to upgrade.

CoffeeDan wrote:Many of the extras look like they've been carried over from the WB/MK2 release of MODERN TIMES, and if that's the case, the "deleted" scenes are two sequences cut from the film BEFORE its release in 1936 -- and are very much worth having. So let's not panic before we have to.

Of course they're worth having, but that's not the point. The outtake of the Tramp trying to cross the busy street was indeed a pre-release deletion (hence it being presented unrestored with no audio in the WB/MK2 release), and belongs among the extras, BUT the final verse of the nonsense song was present and accounted for in the 1936 release; it was cut by Chaplin twenty years later for the 1956 reissue. So, it should be included in the film proper, as it was in David Shepard's release through Image.

Here's the reply I got from Criterion today:

Thank you for your email! The Chaplin family stands behind Charlie Chaplin's decision to have the final verse removed, and this is indeed the version of the film we've licensed from them. We're sorry you'll be missing our edition of the film, as it promises to be a more well-rounded edition in terms of the supplements, plus an improved picture and sound, (and it's available blu-ray!). The final verse will be included as a supplement, as MK2 had presented it.


I replied back advising Criterion that since that was the case I would not be purchasing any of the Criterion Chaplin releases, blu-ray or not.

Well, that settles that then. I just saved a few hundred dollars.

I feel sad for Criterion, because the Estate's wrongheaded attitude is costing them sales. Between Brian and I, there's a grand right there.

So if Chaplin decided to outright disown one of his films (other than Woman of the Sea) and destroyed the negative and all prints he could get his hands on, would his estate stand behind that? I guess the film's non-existence would be, after all, his final word on it! (Reductio ad absurdum, maybe, but worth thinking about.)

That said, I only have the MK2 edition of The Gold Rush. I'm aware that The Kid is cut pretty severely, but how badly are A Woman of Paris, The Circus, City Lights and the FN shorts affected? The 30-second cut in Modern Times is disappointing, but not (IMO) an absolute deal-breaker--it's somewhat comparable to Paramount's odd decision to leave the Technicolor segment of The Ten Commandments in B&W and put the colour footage in the bonus section of the disc.

-Harold

Harold Aherne wrote:So if Chaplin decided to outright disown one of his films (other than Woman of the Sea) and destroyed the negative and all prints he could get his hands on, would his estate stand behind that? I guess the film's non-existence would be, after all, his final word on it! (Reductio ad absurdum, maybe, but worth thinking about.)

That said, I only have the MK2 edition of The Gold Rush. I'm aware that The Kid is cut pretty severely, but how badly are A Woman of Paris, The Circus, City Lights and the FN shorts affected? The 30-second cut in Modern Times is disappointing, but not (IMO) an absolute deal-breaker--it's somewhat comparable to Paramount's odd decision to leave the Technicolor segment of The Ten Commandments in B&W and put the colour footage in the bonus section of the disc.

-Harold

A WOMAN OF PARIS is missing some complete scenes, though I don't know offhand exactly what they are as it's been many years since I watched the cut version, and can't find exact details online.

THE CIRCUS isn't missing anything except for the original opening credits; they were redone by Charlie for the reissue, and he also repeated a hunk of footage from later in the film at the beginning, of the girl swinging on a trapeze, with him singing "Swing Little Girl" over it.

CITY LIGHTS isn't missing anything either, although the Shepard release is full-aperture, unlike the WB/MK2.

Nearly all the First National shorts are missing footage in the WB/MK2s I believe, though again, I'm not quite sure which ones are missing what, as it's been many years since I've seen the cut versions, and I can't find exact details online. Also be aware that even the uncut FN shorts are not the original theatrical versions; they were assembled by Charlie's cameraman Rollie Totheroh from outtakes in the '40s for reissue, as the original negatives had worn out from overprinting. David Shepard found prints of the original versions of some of the films, but apparently had no luck with getting the Estate's blessing to release them.

The Kid is missing a lot of the sequences with Purviance, including a scene where she meets the Kid's father, who has become a successful painter. It's implied that they may get back together, which of course impacts the film's ending.

A WOMAN OF PARIS is missing only two things.

Shortly after the film opens there is a close up to a Black Ribbon were there is a picture of Edna Purviance's mother in order to reflect that the bad relationship with her father was due to her death.

The other scene missing is when Carl Miller's mother finds Edna crying in front of her dead son: she put away the gun that she had, gets near her and begins to cry.

All First National films are fraudulent versions, even if they were cut by Chaplin, for the following reason:

I just sent Jon Mulvaney a note stating my objections to their Chaplin releases. This in a year when we are about to be treated to the restored Chaplin Keystones. Almost unbelievable. Criterion is a fine company. but this is clearly a mistake on their part. I hope they use the restored version of The Rink!

Bob Furem wrote:I just sent Jon Mulvaney a note stating my objections to their Chaplin releases. This in a year when we are about to be treated to the restored Chaplin Keystones. Almost unbelievable. Criterion is a fine company. but this is clearly a mistake on their part. I hope they use the restored version of The Rink!

As has been noted, it's not Criterion's fault, it's the Chaplin Estate's fault. Criterion can only license what the Estate will allow them to license.

WaverBoy wrote:As has been noted, it's not Criterion's fault, it's the Chaplin Estate's fault. Criterion can only license what the Estate will allow them to license.

But if Criterion and other companies refused to license the edited versions, the Estate would have to reconsider if they want to get paid. Obviously Criterion is betting that most people won't know the difference and had already written people like us off when they made their business decision to grab whatever loot they can, touting Blu-Ray and special features. Hopefully there's more of us than they expected and they lose money on the deal.

Harold,

Chaplin didn't butcher all of the films. What about THE CHAPLIN REVUE? Now I still have the old Playhouse VHS from the 1985. I can tell you that both A DOG'S LIFE and SHOULDER ARMS, were further Cut from the original release of THE CHAPLIN REVUE in 1959. And certainly not for the better. I'm not sure about THE PILGRIM? I never got through that after seeing the poor choice of edits to the other two films in the compilation by MK-2.

Speedy,

MODERN TIMES was re-released in 1953, not 1956. I have never understood Chaplin's reason for cutting the verse? Of course I don't understand any of the later cuts to his films.

THE RINK on the Criterion DVD of MODERN TIMES will be the same as is on the 90th Anniversary Edition of the Mutuals, with the Carl Davis score. It runs at 20 fps, and has the original intertitles and some bits that were missing from my earlier video editions.

David Shepard

I did not mean to suggest that Criterion had a choice and chose the wrong versions. Clearly the Estate holds the cards. I don't know exactly who the Estate is at this point, but obviously there has been a sea change in their attitude since Mr. Shepard's wonderful restorations at the dawn of the DVD era. I believe some of the cuts Mr. Chaplin made, though not the case with Modern Times, was the concern many silent film actors felt at showing their films to "modern"audiences. That is, they worried that parts of their films would appear excessively sentimental to the audience of today. I believe that is the case with The Kid and A Woman Of Paris. I also understand that the Chaplin films are a potential financial windfall to a company like Criterion. However, I've got a couple of shelves full of Criterion DVDs based on their well-deserved reputation for releasing films properly. I believe the Chaplin Estate is out of touch with their audience, and I don't know what else to do but register my disappointment with Criterion.

Bob,

You hit the nail directly on the head. Tell these Heir's that they are completely out of touch with their audience, and apparently just don't get that. Well, it's about time that they did. Well past that point. as for the perceived sentimentality issue, it's a testament to a day when the human race had real genuine heart, and still understood what that was. As opposed to today where any semblance of such seems to be sadly lacking.

Gagman 66 wrote:
Speedy,

MODERN TIMES was re-released in 1953, not 1956.

I see; the only year I could find referenced was 1956, but I don't have a ton of Chaplin reference books. Is this in one of Robinson's books?

Speedy,

SMILE was a top 10 Hit for Nat King Cole in 1953, to coincide with the re-issue of Chaplin's MODERN TIMES. Also should mention that CITY LIGHTS was re-released in 1950. I doubt if there is any chance that we will get the alternate recording of Chaplin's score, reprised by Carl Davis in 1988, and featured on the old Image DVD release.