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Better than various drafts of the LAM scripts, the Library of Congress has a cutting continuity that was evidently made by viewing the actual film. Until a print is found, this may be the closest we'll get to "seeing" this film.

http://oldhollywoodincolor.com/2014/08/ ... ty-script/" target="_blank

The NY State archive has it listed too, with eliminations. Not sure what their holdings look like for silents (it's usually just the dialogue for talkies). The eliminations might be interesting though.

Spiny Norman wrote:The NY State archive has it listed too, with eliminations. Not sure what their holdings look like for silents (it's usually just the dialogue for talkies). The eliminations might be interesting though.

Good luck finding any silent film holdings at the NY State Archive. They may have the titles listed on their website but every time I have requested any silent title, they have nothing.

The NYS archives doesn't have the cutting continuity for LAM. When I researching "American SilentHorror, Sci-Fi" and Fantasy Features" I used the archives quite frequently. There are no scripts for silents, usually just paper work about their registration. However, if the New York censors had problems with the film and demanded cuts all the correspondence on that topic would there. That sometimes proved fascinating. For LAM the censors wanted a couple of shots involving hypnosis removed and cutting down the shot of Sir James forcing Balfour-at gunpoint-to write a letter. Apparently they had no trouble with the "vampire" sequences. The LoC cutting continuity actually makes the story more confusing than ever. interestingly enough the continuity refers to Chaney's "vampire" as "the old man", never "the man in the beaver hat"
Henry Nicolella

LouieD wrote:

Spiny Norman wrote:The NY State archive has it listed too, with eliminations. Not sure what their holdings look like for silents (it's usually just the dialogue for talkies). The eliminations might be interesting though.

Good luck finding any silent film holdings at the NY State Archive. They may have the titles listed on their website but every time I have requested any silent title, they have nothing.

I suspect that the NY State Archive has been hit hard by budget cuts - or simply no longer cares - or both. It took a while, but they sent me a sh*tload of sound cutting scripts 10-15 years ago. Every request I have sent - and every request I know someone else has sent - has not been answered. No "sorry" letter. Just crickets.

Henry Nicolella wrote:The LoC cutting continuity actually makes the story more confusing than ever. interestingly enough the continuity refers to Chaney's "vampire" as "the old man", never "the man in the beaver hat"
Henry Nicolella

True. Having just read it I suspect that different people wrote different parts, i.e., reels. LC is referred to as Burke, as the vampire - OK I can understand that - but most confusingly, simply as Chaney. Comparing various stills to the description is somewhat helpful in figuring out the character when he's named "Chaney."

Harlett O'Dowd wrote:I suspect that the NY State Archive has been hit hard by budget cuts - or simply no longer cares - or both. It took a while, but they sent me a sh*tload of sound cutting scripts 10-15 years ago. Every request I have sent - and every request I know someone else has sent - has not been answered. No "sorry" letter. Just crickets.

I've sent requests twice within the last year and both times it's taken several months to get anything back - and you have to goose them periodically to get it to happen. On the upside, they do seem to feel a sense of shame and send the material no charge at that point. Great stuff when you can get it (both were sound films in these cases).

--Peter

Harlett O'Dowd wrote:[
I suspect that the NY State Archive has been hit hard by budget cuts - or simply no longer cares - or both. It took a while, but they sent me a sh*tload of sound cutting scripts 10-15 years ago. Every request I have sent - and every request I know someone else has sent - has not been answered. No "sorry" letter. Just crickets.

Interesting. I have had good luck with them in the past. I just used their on-line request form and they contacted me with price and everything and it's been delivered promptly. As I wrote, I have never received any info from any of the silents I have looked up. Most of the scripts I have received from them have been just "dialog from the screen" which isn't bad because some I have gotten are lost or not available for viewing. Sometimes I've received a LOT more than I bargained for, which is what happened when I requested the file on Wheeler & Woolsey's "So This Is Africa", which I wrote about here:

http://www.elbrendel.com/2009/04/so-this-is-africa.html" target="_blank

For this film I got the "dialog on screen" script, an early draft of the script, censors records, and censors correspondence from other states. I think it was over 140 pages of stuff.

oldposterho wrote:

Harlett O'Dowd wrote:I suspect that the NY State Archive has been hit hard by budget cuts - or simply no longer cares - or both. It took a while, but they sent me a sh*tload of sound cutting scripts 10-15 years ago. Every request I have sent - and every request I know someone else has sent - has not been answered. No "sorry" letter. Just crickets.

I've sent requests twice within the last year and both times it's taken several months to get anything back - and you have to goose them periodically to get it to happen. On the upside, they do seem to feel a sense of shame and send the material no charge at that point. Great stuff when you can get it (both were sound films in these cases).

--Peter

Strange, I NEVER have any problems of that kind with them. I have one on order even as we speak.

I suspect that it's because I'm on the west coast and way out of their jurisdiction my requests get dropped to the bottom of the pile, that and they have an aversion to sending material to PO boxes which is the only option available in my hick town for mail delivery.

Or perhaps more nefariously it's the start of an east coast - west coast research war, just like the old eescoas-wescoas rap wars of the '80s?

Great resource though. Would love to make a pilgrimage out there to research a stack of films one day.

--Peter

My Grandad saw "London After Midnight" over here in the UK in the early sixties on BBC TV... It's a shame they didn't have video recorders back then as he could have passed it onto me and I'd be so rich now it would be disgusting! But anyway, he said it was a load of rubbish, and by far not one of Chaney's most memorable films. Auntie Beeb apparently had the film, but then sent it back to M-G-M after broadcast! And then of course in 1967 it was burnt to oblivion, never to be seen ever again!

David Alp wrote:My Grandad saw "London After Midnight" over here in the UK in the early sixties on BBC TV... It's a shame they didn't have video recorders back then as he could have passed it onto me and I'd be so rich now it would be disgusting! But anyway, he said it was a load of rubbish, and by far not one of Chaney's most memorable films. Auntie Beeb apparently had the film, but then sent it back to M-G-M after broadcast! And then of course in 1967 it was burnt to oblivion, never to be seen ever again!

Hm. Interesting. They'd use a normal print for that?
I wonder if there were no "Cura telesnaps" for it. But those might have been destroyed also.

David Alp wrote:My Grandad saw "London After Midnight" over here in the UK in the early sixties on BBC TV... It's a shame they didn't have video recorders back then as he could have passed it onto me and I'd be so rich now it would be disgusting! But anyway, he said it was a load of rubbish, and by far not one of Chaney's most memorable films. Auntie Beeb apparently had the film, but then sent it back to M-G-M after broadcast! And then of course in 1967 it was burnt to oblivion, never to be seen ever again!

Oh, geez . . . If you still have it right on your hand, then you'd capped over hundred thousands dollars for it ! Gone right in the gutter . . .

Harlett O'Dowd wrote:

LouieD wrote:

Spiny Norman wrote:The NY State archive has it listed too, with eliminations. Not sure what their holdings look like for silents (it's usually just the dialogue for talkies). The eliminations might be interesting though.

Good luck finding any silent film holdings at the NY State Archive. They may have the titles listed on their website but every time I have requested any silent title, they have nothing.

I suspect that the NY State Archive has been hit hard by budget cuts - or simply no longer cares - or both. It took a while, but they sent me a sh*tload of sound cutting scripts 10-15 years ago. Every request I have sent - and every request I know someone else has sent - has not been answered. No "sorry" letter. Just crickets.

Budget cuts is the problem. I've been using the archive for 30 years, and never had a problem until last year. I drove to Albany and requested a couple of scripts. They informed me that, due to staff reductions, documents are now only being pulled from the shelves twice a day, and I had missed the last deadline. The archive was open for three more hours; but they wouldn't retrieve the scripts until the following day. I politely thanked them and haven't been back since.

Just curious, anyone else ever hear of the BBC screening London After Midnight in the early '60s? I suppose anything's possible, but it seem unlikely MGM would ship an archival (35mm?) print to England for a one-off TV screening, at a time when the silent film shows of the era tended more towards the Fractured Flickers variety.

If anyone feels like scouring back issues of Radio Times to find out...

David Alp wrote:My Grandad saw "London After Midnight" over here in the UK in the early sixties on BBC TV... It's a shame they didn't have video recorders back then as he could have passed it onto me and I'd be so rich now it would be disgusting! But anyway, he said it was a load of rubbish, and by far not one of Chaney's most memorable films. Auntie Beeb apparently had the film, but then sent it back to M-G-M after broadcast! And then of course in 1967 it was burnt to oblivion, never to be seen ever again!

David, I'm not doubting your grandfather but can you tell us more about how you found out about it. Second and third hand info sources do become muddled. For example, I can believe that your grandfather really watched MARK OF THE VAMPIRE on BBC TV and recalled that he had seen the silent version in his younger days in the theater. It's not much of a step to transform the account.

bobfells wrote:

David Alp wrote:My Grandad saw "London After Midnight" over here in the UK in the early sixties on BBC TV... It's a shame they didn't have video recorders back then as he could have passed it onto me and I'd be so rich now it would be disgusting! But anyway, he said it was a load of rubbish, and by far not one of Chaney's most memorable films. Auntie Beeb apparently had the film, but then sent it back to M-G-M after broadcast! And then of course in 1967 it was burnt to oblivion, never to be seen ever again!

David, I'm not doubting your grandfather but can you tell us more about how you found out about it. Second and third hand info sources do become muddled. For example, I can believe that your grandfather really watched MARK OF THE VAMPIRE on BBC TV and recalled that he had seen the silent version in his younger days in the theater. It's not much of a step to transform the account.

also auntie beeb sent copies of the old doctor who overseas then when returned destroyed them. copies of old doctor who show (missing ones) show up here and there (down from 152 in 1978 to 97 in 2014, maybe more depending on the rumors out there).

goalieboy82 wrote:also auntie beeb sent copies of the old doctor who overseas then when returned destroyed them. copies of old doctor who show (missing ones) show up here and there (down from 152 in 1978 to 97 in 2014, maybe more depending on the rumors out there).

More or less true if only very abridged; but it's rather irrelevant?