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I won't be surprised if there are some folks who have firsthand knowledge of this affair. Greenbriar Picture Shows is doing a fascinating three-part account of a scandal in the collecting world some 40 years ago. In the first part, he discusses the careers of screenwriter Francis Marion and her husband, the deeply unlucky cowboy star Fred Thomson, who was screwed over by Joe Kennedy and all but one of his films lost after his early death.

In the second part, he talks about how hopes for their rediscovery were raised:

Tom Osteen was the Brevard, NC projectionist and collector who claimed to possess three of Fred Thomson’s Paramount features. A Sensational Announcement, he called it, with long lost Jesse James, Kit Carson, and The Sunset Legion slated for release through Osteen’s Sylvan Films. Classic Film Collector Publisher/Editor Samuel K. Rubin had visited Tom in Brevard and saw film boxes clearly labeled. He took Osteen’s word as to contents inside and began promoting the Fred Thomson westerns to come. Readers sent advance payments for Jesse James, its early 1971 delivery assured by Sylvan (with Kit Carson to follow in mid-1971 and The Sunset Legion set for 1972 availability, per Osteen).

You'll have to wait till next week for part 3...

It's FRANCES.... and didn't Thomson drown?

Kennedy pretty much mishandled his entire film "career," including the FBO pictures.

If anyone was taken in (I'll eschew the word "screw" here) by Kennedy, it was Gloria Swanson, especially after she realized Joe was gambling on Queen Kelly with Swanson's money!

Thomson died of tetanus.

then who drowned?

maybe it was the cowboy star husband of Nell Shipman ?

Well, a great story! I can't wait to read part III. I need to add Greenbriar to my regular reading list, some interesting stuff there.

Self Styled Siren is also a favorite read.

Of course, when I read the title, I thought of another collecting scandal, currently in progress.

While only one Thompson western exists, Thundering Hoofs, (1924)you can see him in as Mary Pickford's leading man in The Love Light (1921), which is on DVD.

silentfilm wrote:While only one Thompson western exists, Thundering Hoofs, (1924)you can see him in as Mary Pickford's leading man in The Love Light (1921), which is on DVD.

The Love Light is a Frances Marion story, too...and the dvd is available from Milestone Video! http://www.milestonefilms.com/movie.php/love/

A few years ago at a Saturday morning "unidentified and incomplete film snippets" screening at UCLA, Bob Birchard identified Thomson in some of the films. As I recall they were outtakes, but don't quote me and I don't know what happened with the film after that.

It's been a bit since I read Without Lying Down, I thought Thomson died at home, rather than in a hospital?

Fred

Frederica wrote:

silentfilm wrote:While only one Thompson western exists, Thundering Hoofs, (1924)you can see him in as Mary Pickford's leading man in The Love Light (1921), which is on DVD.

The Love Light is a Frances Marion story, too...and the dvd is available from Milestone Video! http://www.milestonefilms.com/movie.php/love/

A few years ago at a Saturday morning "unidentified and incomplete film snippets" screening at UCLA, Bob Birchard identified Thomson in some of the films. As I recall they were outtakes, but don't quote me and I don't know what happened with the film after that.

That was several reels of second-unit footage of action and stunt shots that had belonged to J.P. McGowan that we were watching that Thomsen had turned up in, proving that the Cowboy star did at least some of his own stunts.

Most of Thomsen's film GALLOPING GALLAGHER also survives (it's missing the first reel or so), I think Grapevine Video offers a DVD with both it and THUNDERING HOOFS on it.

RICHARD M ROBERTS

Well, if I remember correctly, after announcing the films extensively in the pages of The 8mm/16mm Collector, Osteen claimed to have a flood in his basement and rgat he lost all three films as a result of the flood.

I don't remember if he collected any money or not or if he returned any monies he received, but my recollection is he settled up. I don't recall any big stink--just major disappointment on the part of the few who would have ordered the Thomsons.

UCLA does indeed have some outtakes from one of the late FBO Thomsons. The footage is all unedited dailies, but a sequence could be made of the footage.

drednm wrote:then who drowned?

Hmm not sure who you're thinking of. With Frances her second husband was in a car crash and killed himself soon after in quite a scandal (Gloria Swanson mentioned it in her autobiography).

Scandals are always interesting to hear about when done right (not Hollywood Babylon styled but ya know with facts...)

According to Edgar M. Wyatt's book, More than a Cowboy, THE LOVE LIGHT, A CHAPTER IN HER LIFE and THUNDERING HOOFS all exist. After this book was written, 35 minutes of GALLOPING GALLAGHER was found. A private collector also has 2 minutes of THE FIGHTING SAP.
There are also a lot of rumours of Fred Thomson's films existing in private collections and archives. One collector is supposed to own 5 early FBO films including THE DANGEROUS COWARD and THE FIGHTING SAP. It is thought that THE MASK OF LOPEZ, THE TOUGH GUY and ARIZONA NIGHTS exist in an Eastern European archive. One private collector claimed to have JESSE JAMES and another is supposed to have THE MASK OF LOPEZ in his collection.
I have the first reel of The THE TWO-GUN MAN in my collection and recently got Jack Hardy from Grapevine Video to copy it, along with some of my other rare nitrate. He plans to release it on a DVD sometime in the future.

Bob Birchard wrote:Well, if I remember correctly, after announcing the films extensively in the pages of The 8mm/16mm Collector, Osteen claimed to have a flood in his basement and rgat he lost all three films as a result of the flood.

I don't remember if he collected any money or not or if he returned any monies he received, but my recollection is he settled up. I don't recall any big stink--just major disappointment on the part of the few who would have ordered the Thomsons.

UCLA does indeed have some outtakes from one of the late FBO Thomsons. The footage is all unedited dailies, but a sequence could be made of the footage.

That's how I remember it, too. I don't know that I would call this a collecting scandal. The news made a splash and then; disappointment. I don't think Sam Rubin even included this incident in his book.

Back in those days it was common for there to be excitement over news of a reputed discovery of a previously unavailable silent film. Some panned out, and some didn't. It was par for the course. Sam's "Collector's Court" was where things like this got hashed out.

It's amazing to think of how many films we have available to us now on shiny discs and that we take for granted that were big news when they surfaced back in the 8mm/16mm collector days.

Bob Birchard wrote:Well, if I remember correctly, after announcing the films extensively in the pages of The 8mm/16mm Collector, Osteen claimed to have a flood in his basement and rgat he lost all three films as a result of the flood.

I don't remember if he collected any money or not or if he returned any monies he received, but my recollection is he settled up. I don't recall any big stink--just major disappointment on the part of the few who would have ordered the Thomsons.

According to part two on Greenbriar, money WAS collected by Tom Osteen... and NOT refunded:

"Months would pass in silence from Brevard. Checks sent had been cashed, but those refunds weren’t happening. Osteen ran an ad looking to dispose of printing equipment, so clearly Sylvan had tossed in the towel with regard generating film. A year plus six months went by before Tom landed in the CFC’s Collector’s Court, a one-man tribunal Sam Rubin established to keep dealers honest. But there was no luck bringing Tom to earth. Well, maybe those NC mountains had swallowed him up."

Michael