The Cocoanuts (1929)

[daveboz]

And let us not forget the presence, in her first film, of the Ravishing and Radiant Kay Francis!

[KenGriffin]

Bit of a chicken and egg situation here I reckon. There doesn't exist a decent print; therefore it's never shown; therefore it's not seen as popular within the Bros body of work; therefore new prints/restoration is not high priority

I know what you mean but it is really surprising, given that the restoration itself doesn't seem that complex: it seems that the marriage of the current Universal print and the UCLA Nitrate is all that is needed.

[Jim Roots]

I must confess I'm at a loss for the reason for this debate. The film is already available in DVD as part of a glistening Marx Brothers set released about five years ago.

Sure, there are sections of the DVD version that aren't pristine, but as somebody pointed out already, it's the best you're going to get off the surviving source materials.

So what's the point of this discussion?

Jim

[boblipton]

And, as James Agee pointed out, Second Rate Marx Brothers is better than first rate other stuff.

Bob

[Michael O'Regan]

I must confess I'm at a loss for the reason for this debate. The film is already available in DVD as part of a glistening Marx Brothers set released about five years ago.

Sure, there are sections of the DVD version that aren't pristine, but as somebody pointed out already, it's the best you're going to get off the surviving source materials.

So what's the point of this discussion?

Jim

No big deal, old chap.
We like talking about film.

[drednm]

The Cocoanuts is also of interest to fans of Kay Francis as her film debut. Judging from the positive reaction to TCM's recent (summer 2009?) touting of Kay as Star of the Month and showing many of her rarer films, she picked up quite a few fans.

[Frederica]

And let us not forget the presence, in her first film, of the Ravishing and Radiant Kay Francis!

That's "Wavishing and Wadiant" around here, fella.

[Richard M Roberts]

The Cocoanuts is also of interest to fans of Kay Francis as her film debut. Judging from the positive reaction to TCM's recent (summer 2009?) touting of Kay as Star of the Month and showing many of her rarer films, she picked up quite a few fans.

Actually, GENTLEMEN OF THE PRESS was Kay Francis's debut, THE COCOANUTS is her second film. And she has much more to do in GENTLEMEN OF THE PRESS, so it's a better film for her to start with anyway.

RICHARD M ROBERTS

[colbyco82]

I must confess I'm at a loss for the reason for this debate. The film is already available in DVD as part of a glistening Marx Brothers set released about five years ago.

Sure, there are sections of the DVD version that aren't pristine, but as somebody pointed out already, it's the best you're going to get off the surviving source materials.

So what's the point of this discussion?

Jim

But there are better surviving source materials, or at least thats what part of the debate is about. Parts of the current Cocoanuts DVD print are beautiful, so beautiful that it makes the switch to murky,public-domain-quality scenes that much more jarring.

[daveboz]

And let us not forget the presence, in her first film, of the Ravishing and Radiant Kay Francis!

That's "Wavishing and Wadiant" around here, fella.

==============

Didn't want to spoil your fun!

[drednm]

Well yes. Gentlemen of the Press was Kay's first film (and she's spectacular) released May 1929. The Cocoanuts was August 1929. I wonder why so many references list the Marx Bros. film first?

[Harold Aherne]

In terms of production and release, Gentlemen of the Press came first: the NYT of 6 Jan. 1929 reported that production had begun "during the past week" at the Astoria facilities. The (St. Petersburg, FL) Evening Independent reported on 2 Feb. that The Cocoanuts "will go into production as an all-talking musical comedy film at Paramount's Long Island studio next Monday [4 Feb]. Rehearsals commenced yesterday afternoon".

Gentlemen of the Press opened in LA on 10 May 1929 at the Paramount Theatre according to LAT of the following day. The film opened in New York at that city's Paramount no later than 12 May. However, it appears that the picture may have opened in Miami by 2 May, according to the Miami News of that day.

The Cocoanuts debuted at the Rialto in New York on 23 May 1929, which is agreed upon by a couple of NYT notices around the same time. The LA opening occured later in the month and the film played in many additional cities before broad release in August.

-Harold

[Richard M Roberts]

Well yes. Gentlemen of the Press was Kay's first film (and she's spectacular) released May 1929. The Cocoanuts was August 1929. I wonder why so many references list the Marx Bros. film first?

Easy Answer: Because they're wrong.

RICHARD M ROBERTS

[drednm]

Easy Answer: Because they're wrong.

Well yes. In any case, fans of Kay Francis will STILL be interested in The Cocoanuts because it's not her usual role.

As stagebound as severa; of the Marx Bros' films are, this one gets a huge boost from Mary Eaton and the "Monkey Doodle Doo" number. Yes it's still stagy, but at least there are a few different camera angles and the number bursts with energy.

[Norma Desmond]

I'd like to put in a good word for Mary Eaton in this musical. She puts in a fine performance. It's a shame, but like so many others with talent, her career faded despite this, and she succumbed to alcoholism. Forgetting my dislike of the M Brothers for one moment, I can say that this movie has some of the best song & dance routines to be found in the musical genre. The general positive, joyous atmosphere of the film is a fine example of early talkies before Black Friday, 1929.

Norma

[drednm]

I agree about Mary Eaton.... I think Glorifying the American Girl done her in...

Her sister Doris Eaton (born 1904) is still alive and working.....

[Norma Desmond]

Thanks for that, Ed. So, just one movie flop did her in!?? Just one more proof that life just isn't fair.

Norma

[FrankFay]

Well yes. Gentlemen of the Press was Kay's first film (and she's spectacular) released May 1929. The Cocoanuts was August 1929. I wonder why so many references list the Marx Bros. film first?

Didn't I read that Kay Francis can be spotted in a bit part in some silent film? It wouldn't count as a debut any more than Norma Shearer's appearance as a schoolgirl in The Flapper.

[Robert Moulton]

Going from memory here: The currently available print runs four minutes shorter than the original release version. Is the reason for the four minute shortage due to either:

- four minutes snipped out due to censors for a re-release of the film
- four minutes dropped due to really poor film quality of what was available?

Does anyone know what this four minutes is? Is it found within the reels described in the original post?

[Richard M Roberts]

Going from memory here: The currently available print runs four minutes shorter than the original release version. Is the reason for the four minute shortage due to either:

- four minutes snipped out due to censors for a re-release of the film
- four minutes dropped due to really poor film quality of what was available?

Does anyone know what this four minutes is? Is it found within the reels described in the original post?

Assuming that you're talking about THE COCOANUTS, it was indeed Breened for it's 1939 reissue, just as ANIMAL CRACKERS and HORSEFEATHERS were as well. Unfortunately, the reissue versions are all that are currently available. None of the Marx Brother Paramount Films really survive in pristine condition, all five could stand new restorations.

RICHARD M ROBERTS

[antoniod]

It really wasn't just "Glorifying the American Girl".(Read Doris Eaton's book, "Century Girl". After the stock market crash, Mary could still get work, but what was offered wasn't "Good" enough(Vaudeville tours, for example).

[greta de groat]

I'd like to put in a good word for Mary Eaton in this musical. She puts in a fine performance. It's a shame, but like so many others with talent, her career faded despite this, and she succumbed to alcoholism. Forgetting my dislike of the M Brothers for one moment, I can say that this movie has some of the best song & dance routines to be found in the musical genre. The general positive, joyous atmosphere of the film is a fine example of early talkies before Black Friday, 1929.

Norma

I've always been a huge Marx Brothers fan, but this film has always been one of my favorites partly because of musical numbers and obvious stage origins. While it seemed something of an archaeological artifact, i still loved the singing and dancing in it. As for Mary Eaton, she's a good singer and dancer, though her personality on screen comes across as rather hard boiled. That's inconsequential in this film and works well i thought for Glorifying the American Girl. But it would be limiting for your average leading role in film musicals, and i'm not surprised she didn't do more.

greta

[gjohnson]

I find the most fascinating aspect to "The Cocoanuts" is its historical fascination. "The Cocoanuts" has been called 'a curio', 'a talkie relic' and 'a badly filmed stage play'. It is all of those things. It is also the best recorded document we have of the Marx Bros. as stage performers. While "Animal Crackers" - (1930) is also a filmed stage play it is light years ahead of "The Cocoanuts" technically and artistically. But "The Cocoanuts" does exist as is....warts and all.

The first impression one gets from the film is how young the Marxes look. And yet Groucho was 39 and his brothers were in their forties. Groucho gets to spout some hilarious lines throughout (alligator pears anyone?) courtesy of George Kaufman but his delivery doesn't always have the same bite that it would, say two years later for "Monkey Business". Watching the film reveals a group of stage professionals either ill at ease performing in front of cameras or (more likely) not interested enough in learning the basic rudiments to filmmaking. Throughout the movie the Boys miss their marks, wander out of camera range, stumble over dialogue and step on each others lines. And all of this is kept in the final cut as if the play was filmed live and sent out as is.

Now we have all watched clunky talkies from the first transitional years of sound and know about cameras being put into soundproof boxes that weighed more than the National debt and had zero mobility but to watch it vainly trying to keep up with Groucho as he begins calling for his bellboys as if they were dogs is unintentionally funny on top of the already intentionally funny actions of Groucho itself. By the time they get around to filming the major comic set piece of all of the Brothers running in and out of Kay Francis' room the director has basically given up and just pulls the camera back to the upper balcony and films the scene in one long shot. There are only a few close-ups of the Brothers during their galloping and yet we still miss out on a major laugh when Kay says "everything is going along swimmingly' and unbeknownst to her Harpo is passing by her feet performing the breast stroke. He then turns and lets loose a stream of water from his mouth which is obscurred because Kay is now blocking his view from the camera. All we see is a trickle of water shooting out from Kay's ankles.

And all that said the film is still jammed pack with classic Marx bits such as the wonderful first meeting between all four brothers in the hotel lobby, Harpo dipping into the punch bowl during the party scene and the first of many pointless exchanges between Groucho and Chico, a duck and a lots of limp maps.

Everyone can wish for a clean nitrate print of this film but that would not change the history of the time that Hollywood tried to film a smash Broadway hit and failed miserably at it. But it was the Marx Bros. who won. They defeated Paramount. They defeated their own show but they still persevered. They were now on film and would be etched into our conscience forever more.

Gary J.

[MikeH0714]

The first impression one gets from the film is how young the Marxes look. And yet Groucho was 39 and his brothers were in their forties.

Zeppo wasn't in his forties... he was 28. Just sayin'.

Michael

[Hal Erickson]

And speaking of Zeppo...I believe his role was severely diminished in the reissue. Didn't he have an opening scene with the bellboys before Groucho's entrance? (it might have actually been a short song, like his intros to Groucho in ANIMAL CRACKERS and DUCK SOUP).

[Rob Farr]

And speaking of Zeppo...I believe his role was severely diminished in the reissue. Didn't he have an opening scene with the bellboys before Groucho's entrance? (it might have actually been a short song, like his intros to Groucho in ANIMAL CRACKERS and DUCK SOUP).

According to the Cocoanuts stage script published in By George, the play opens thusly:

"AT RISE: Discovered: A number of hotel guests on stage. JAMISON and Ensemble go into OPENING NUMBER joined by BELLBOYS. At the number's end, the BELLBOYS remain on stage."

Jamison and the bellboys have a page of dialogue in which he tells them the guests are complaining of bad service and the bellboys respond that they haven't been paid. Then follows a few lines of dialogue between Jamison and Mrs. Potter. Groucho doesn't show up until much later.

Whether any of this was originally filmed for the Cocoanuts film is anyone's guess. And what was the opening number that Zeppo performed in? In the film it's "Lovely Florida", though sung in voiceover rather a choreographed number.

[Hal Erickson]

And what was the opening number that Zeppo performed in? In the film it's "Lovely Florida", though sung in voiceover rather a choreographed number.[/quote]

In the original theatrical program, the song is listed as "The Guests", performed by "Zeppo Marx, The Cocoanut Grove Girls and Boys."
"Florida by the Sea" is listed as the sixth number. It was also performed by Zeppo, Lehman Bick (whoever that was), and the same "Girls and Boys." This number followed "A Little Bungalow" (not performed by Groucho, but by the actors playing Bob and Polly), and came before "Monkey Doodle Doo" (performed by Frances Williams, playing "Frances Williams", the Breen Brothers and Ensemble--so Polly didn't have that one originally, but instead it was a specialty).

There was another ensemble number in Act One, performed by Groucho: "Why Am I a Hit with the Ladies." Wish they'd filmed THAT one!

[gjohnson]

Broadway shows generally ran 3 plus hours with an intermission. And the stars never opened their own shows. They sat in the wings playing pinochle while a few dozen musical numbers warmed up the audience waiting for their appearance.

A Hollywood production usually ran 90 mins. and after a quick opening number they wanted their stars on the screen pronto!

There was always a lot of 'book' editing of a Broadway show when transferring it to film and in this case who better to have his part cut down to nothing than Zeppo?

Gary J.

[Hal Erickson]

I'd sooner have more of Zeppo and less of Oscar Shaw.

[Harlett O'Dowd]

"Florida by the Sea" is listed as the sixth number. It was also performed by Zeppo, Lehman Bick (whoever that was)

Lehman Byck was, naturally enough, a song and dance man of the mid-late 20s. If remembred at all, it is for the show he left The Cocoanuts to do - the first (1926) edition of Americana - where he introduced "Thanks Awful" with the up-and-coming Helen Morgan.