1929 Madame X

[rudyfan]

Has anyone seen this film with Ruth Chatterton? I've long wanted to and as far as I can recall, it's not screened on TCM, at least not in my memory.

[drednm]

Oh I'm sure this has been on TCM. I'm sure that's where I got my copy.

It's the Gladys George version that's more likely unseen, which is a pity since it's the best.

as for Lana Turner... BLEH

[greta de groat]

Yes, it's been shown occasionally, though i don't know how long ago it was. I found it disappointing, her speech was very mannered and over-enunciated in a way that 's not the case in her other films (Lionel Barrymore was the director, he seems to bring out the worst in his fellow actors). I found myself mocking the courtroom scene. And I ordinarily love Ruth Chatterton, and aside from her voice, her acting was up to its usual high level.

I still haven't caught up with the Gladys George version, but of course my favorite would be the 1920 Pauline Frederick version, which deserves to be more widely seen.

greta

[Harold Aherne]

The Chatterton version has definitely aired on TCM, although 2003-04 was the last time I'm aware it was shown. It was also released as part of "The Dawn of Sound III" laserdisc collection. The Gladys George version was released on VHS.

The NYT published an interesting article about the making of Madame X on 7 April 1929. It premiered in New York on 24 April at the Sam Harris Theatre, accompanied by the Technicolor short subject Climbing the Golden Stairs.

-Harold

[drednm]

I've not seen the Pauline Frederick version.....

[Christopher Jacobs]

I've got the 1929 version on Laserdisc and while it definitely has the early talkie look and pacing, I still prefer it to the Lana Turner version due to the performances. Ruth Chatterton should have won Best Actress that year over Mary Pickford, or at least tied with Jeanne Eagles.

--Christopher Jacobs
http://hpr1.com/film
http://www.und.edu/instruct/cjacobs

[drednm]

It's funny how many of those "woman sacrifices all for her child" plots there were in early talkies. Ruth Chatterton herself worked this plot in several movies: Sarah and Son and Once a Lady come to mind.

[rudyfan]

Okay, I guess it's time to suggest it to TCM since the film obviously exists. I knoew Barrymore was not a great director, but I still want to see this.

Thanks everyone for all the good info.

Greta, does Pauline Frederick's version exist on DVD/VHS? Or is this archive viewing only?

[dr.giraud]

It's funny how many of those "woman sacrifices all for her child" plots there were in early talkies. Ruth Chatterton herself worked this plot in several movies: Sarah and Son and Once a Lady come to mind.

And also in the wonderful (IMHO, I know that's not a universal reaction) FRISCO JENNY.

[dr.giraud]

Yes, it's been shown occasionally, though i don't know how long ago it was. I found it disappointing, her speech was very mannered and over-enunciated in a way that 's not the case in her other films (Lionel Barrymore was the director, he seems to bring out the worst in his fellow actors). I found myself mocking the courtroom scene. And I ordinarily love Ruth Chatterton, and aside from her voice, her acting was up to its usual high level.

I still haven't caught up with the Gladys George version, but of course my favorite would be the 1920 Pauline Frederick version, which deserves to be more widely seen.

greta

I had exactly the same reaction. Good thing Barrymore went back to acting exclusively--even Lewis Stone is terrible in the '29 MADAME X.

[drednm]

not to mention Raymond Hackett

[Harlett O'Dowd]

It's funny how many of those "woman sacrifices all for her child" plots there were in early talkies. Ruth Chatterton herself worked this plot in several movies: Sarah and Son and Once a Lady come to mind.

I don't find it all that unusual. It's essentially the same hokum as is in the plot of The Jazz Singer except it's tailored as a woman's vehicle. And really, that sort of plot had been a mainstay since the days of East Lynne if not before.

So it would make sense that, when aping the success of The Jazz Singer for a woman star in the tranisitional period, one would gravitate to these types of stories.

[bobfells]

For what it's worth, Ann Harding and James Stewart also played in MADAME X - on the Lux Radio Theater on June 14, 1937. Since this hugely popular show routinely had between 30 million and 50 million listeners around the world (broadcast on shortwave and even listened to shipboard), it is probable that more people heard the Lux broadcast than ever saw the various film versions combined.

We can thank Lux host Cecil B. DeMille for arranging (and paying) to have the broadcasts privately recorded, and then preserved through the decades. At the time, CBS did not have a policy of recording its broadcasts. Today they are easily available on CD and mp3. The guest stars really make for some surprises: they included D.W. Griffith, Theda Bara, David Belasco, and even FDR's mother! (But I digress).

[rollot24]

Wow - I would love to hear Theda Bara and David Belasco's voices

[colbyco82]

Chatterton's Madame X was shown last year during 31 Days of Oscar. (Thats when I recorded my copy, I think) I am a big Chatterton fan, but was really disappointed in the sound and picture quality of the TCM print. It is bad even by 1929's standards; it's a struggle to make out some of the dialogue. I could help but imagine that I would like the film more if it were cleaned up a little.

Btw, now that TCM and Universal are working together they should break out some of Chatterton's Paramount films that have been hiding in the vaults. There are so many just waiting to be seen on TV that probably havent been shown in decades (if ever!)

[rudyfan]

Btw, now that TCM and Universal are working together they should break out some of Chatterton's Paramount films that have been hiding in the vaults. There are so many just waiting to be seen on TV that probably havent been shown in decades (if ever!)

Amen! Brother!

Like you, I'm a big fan of Chatterton and I'd love to see more than I have.

[bobfells]

The Lux shows form a nice addendum to the film careers of many stars. For example, Charles Farrell and Janet Gaynor actually performed SEVENTH HEAVEN on Lux - in 1950! Al Jolson did THE JAZZ SINGER and music director Lou Silver obliged by using the same background music heard in the film (Silvers worked on the '27 film too). Gary Cooper reenacted THE VIRGINIAN and Marion Davies starred in several Lux broadcasts including PEG O' MY HEART. All these broadcasts were live with a studio audience but the real fear for performers was the 30 million + people listening in. It was said the Joan Crawford's was so nervous the script was shaking in her hand. She was trouper though and appeared in many Lux shows playing against type such as MARY OF SCOTLAND and Ibsen's A DOLL'S HOUSE (with Basil Rathbone, of all people).

It's difficult to name a major film star of the late 30s and 40s who did not appear on Lux. There was some real life drama on Lux too - shows during June 1937 had DeMille promoting the appearance of Amelia Earhart after she landed in Burbank completing her around the world flight on or about July 5. On the July 5 show, DeMille announced that there was still hope of finding her. When Jean Harlow died unexpectedly around the same time, DeMille observed a moment of silence in her memory at the end of one broadcast. Harlow had starred on the show just six months earlier.


Anybody interested in hearing the shows, you can find them streamed but of course you don't have your pick. An uncompensated plug - try otrnow.com for the Lux shows on mp3 generously sampled for very good to excellent sound (inexpensive too).

P.S. I just checked the Lux log - Ruth Chatterton apparently made no appearances on Lux although some of her films, such as DODSWORTH, were presented (and with Walter Huston).

[greta de groat]

does Pauline Frederick's version exist on DVD/VHS? Or is this archive viewing only?

PFA showed it in their last GEH retrospective, 8 or 10 years ago i think (along with her The Love that Lives (1917) that i liked even better). Otherwise i guess it's archive viewing, since i don't know of anyone else who has shown it recently. It' a 35mm print and i don't remember any problems with it, so there's no technical reason that it's out of circulation.

Speaking of Lewis Stone, my mother was watching the '29 version with me, and when Lewis Stone announced that he was 29 years old she burst out laughing.

greta

[drednm]

Didn't Lewis Stone set the record for length of service with MGM? He made it into Kenneth Anger's book (another thread).

[daveboz]

[snip]

Speaking of Lewis Stone, my mother was watching the '29 version with me, and when Lewis Stone announced that he was 29 years old she burst out laughing.

========

Lewis Stone was NEVER 29 years old!

[Jim Reid]

Yes, it's been shown occasionally, though i don't know how long ago it was. I found it disappointing, her speech was very mannered and over-enunciated in a way that 's not the case in her other films (Lionel Barrymore was the director, he seems to bring out the worst in his fellow actors). I found myself mocking the courtroom scene. And I ordinarily love Ruth Chatterton, and aside from her voice, her acting was up to its usual high level.

I watched this last night and you're right. Her voice drove me up the wall!

[Mitchell Dvoskin]

Madame X was the film that opened the Landmark Loews Jersey in 1929. We wanted to run it as part of the 75 anniversary weekend back in 2004, but at that time, and probably still, no 35mm prints exist.

[colbyco82]

That probably explains the poor condition of the print on TCM. I'm also curious as to why there is no music over the opening credits and why the soundtrack is barren for the first few minutes of the film. I suppose it could have been intentional, or maybe it was a sound on disc film and the disc is damaged?

[Richard P. May]

It was probably not recorded on disc, as MGM used film.
My guess on MADAME X would be only a preliminary work copy of the track survived. Preservation would possibly have been done at the MGM lab in the 1980s, and the nitrate original material didn't survive much longer.
A good number of the early MGM sound films had the track re-recorded from surviving discs. Even though the original track was film, virtually all the producers made discs to accomodate theaters that only had the Vitaphone sound system. This went on in some cases as late as 1935.
As to the movie itself, it's about as clunky a picture as I can remember.
Long pauses between lines, longer pauses at the end of each reel to allow for changeovers before standard cues were introduced.
As mentioned in an earlier post, Lionel Barrymore didn't quite cut it as a director.

[drednm]

Lionel Barrymore's best stint as a director was guiding John Gilbert and Norma Shearer through two versions of the balcony scene in Hollywood Revue of 1929.

[moviepas]

I reference to MGM, they did have disc soundtracks available and I have two sources of this information, one of which I saw the discs in shipping boxes.

1)I worked with an old man in the latter part of the 1960s at the inner Melbourne suburb of West Melbourne at Allans Music. This guy was a young lad in the early depression years and he had a friend who's family owned a local cinema and he often went on Saturdays to the MGM shipping office in downtown Melbourne and picked up the films with discs soundtracks.

2) In 1971 I was put on to a retired film cutter, come film pick-up(in a taxi) etc for the National Film Theatre, London(BFI). Bert Langdon had had a stroke prior to my meeting him and he lasted until March 1980(about a decade). It had left him with a withered arm and he was angry at his plight. The BFI left him on the payroll or whatever they do for 12 months after which they assumed he would not be coming back. This hurt him but they were right in this case. Bert had worked years in a Camden Town piano making factory and lived there but when I met him when the BFI recommended I get to know him(I was working for a music publisher Breitkopf und Haertel in Wiesbaden/Germany at the time) he was living upstairs in a council block of flats in Kentish Town with his wife May and son, David. His nitrate silents were given to the BFI. Bert belonged to a lot of societies in London and travelled by mini cab to meetings like the Music Hall Society, Silent Movies, other friends who had film nights and Raymond Novarro Club. This is where the discs come in.

Bert knew Ken Russell from the BFI(early in Russell's career) and met and disliked Raymond Rohauer(wh didn't) and had story here re Keaton MGM silents the BFI had and were showing, and knew Anthony(Tony) Slide who went to America and taught and wrote books on silents etc. Slide sent him the Vitaphone discs to two or three Novarro films and I saw these discs at Bert's flat. What happened t them when he died I don't know but I do know that his wife, May, was working cataloguing Bert's records which were in the main music hall & musical comedy 78s. Many had hairline cracks because towards the end he was just jamming them back in but otherwise had been played with fiber needles. She had hoped to sell the stuff thru Christie's auctions but this is where I loose track of what happened. I did visit Ma in summer of 1980 being my last trip(of many) out of Australia and she gave me a book by an Irish writer about a silent film director(name forgotten at present) that the author had gifted Bert and it arrived from Ireland just after he died.

I don't believe bert ever played these discs because he did not have any equipment to do so, only a normal player he could play lps and one for 78s with his fiber needles. He collected the needles in a local park and sharpened them.

In reference to MGM nitrates in Melbourne, the old-time collectors of 35mm never seemed to know where they went for silver reclaiming when finished with but they somehow got an in wit one company that did the job for other companies and reels would disappear which a reel for that copy and a reel from that one of a title until between them the guys had a complete film but the law later came into it and that was that with curt appearances. Rare film today was thus lost in some cases from these raids by the police or prints hurriedly burnt after a guy in the scheme had an issue with someone and turned nasty. An there were house fires with some of this stuff(two that I know about decades ago).

Different discs to the US ones of The King of Jazz turned up in the estate of a former projectionist on another state and his daughter gave these to our government radio network and they played these bit by bit in their Saturday 78rpm nostalgia show in the late 1970s and a late friend who saw the revival screening here in about 1978 of the BBC's print(hijacked copy) related to me that the comedy relief items(Slim Summerville etc) were often different to the one screened in verbal content. I notified the Vitaphone Project a number of years ago and never got a rely from Eon Hutchinson. Disappointing.

[Richard P. May]

As long as we're on the subject of discs for MGM's early sound features, we had a large number of "masters" for pressing these that survived when Turner took over the MGM library.
These were chrome plated, mirror like, metal discs with ridges instead of grooves. They were used to manufacture multiple copies of the discs, with one 16 inch disc for each 10 minute reel of film.
The title of the picture was etched into the blank space at the center.
In later years, these made great wall decorations. A disc with an accompanying still from the feature was framed and hung as a picture.
When Turner merged with WB and left the rented building that had been HQ for about ten years, most of these "disappeared".
I imagine they are still decorating somebody's wall.

[Jack Bess]

I've seen this film on local Philadelphia TV in the late 1980s but it was shown under the name ABSINTHE -- I assume it was retitled when it was sold to TV -- so that may be another way to track it down.

[FrankFay]

Lionel Barrymore's best stint as a director was guiding John Gilbert and Norma Shearer through two versions of the balcony scene in Hollywood Revue of 1929.

UNHOLY NIGHT has it's moments- the cast is first rate and there are some well composed shots- but the pace does it in.

[spadeneal]

Richard -- Too bad about those "masters" -- or rather mothers, or stampers as they are sometimes called. Those can be used to stamp a new, mint condition disc and also can be played; it requires a special stylus and an engineer who knows what they are doing, but it can and has been done. None of the pressings of Glenn Miller's British ABSIE recordings survived as the BBC threw them out after the War, but the stampers did, and that's how (a) they were retrieved and (b) how the Happy Days, later, BMG release "Glenn Miller: The Lost Recordings" came about. So by treating them as wall decorations, Turner lost the value inherent in these sources. I'm sorry too.

spadeneal